verveunofficial.freeforums.org

NORTHERN SOULS
It is currently Thu Jun 22, 2017 1:02 pm

All times are UTC [ DST ]



Welcome
Welcome to verveunofficial

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content, and access many other special features. In addition, registered members also see less advertisements. Registration is fast, simple, and absolutely free, so please, join our community today!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 197 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Joe Col wrote:
graceadelica wrote:
Tresilaze wrote:
Sympathy For the demos should be there


And yet wasn't - funny that. The sessions that laid the foundations of the album and the songs that resonate with people are largely (or completely?) absent from that proposed bonus CD. You automatically assume bad faith on Richard's part and good on Nick's - talk about naive. The bonus disc was clearly very deliberately weighed towards Nick related recordings (who was, surprise surprise, involved in compiling it) - suspicious of that, Richard probably called his bluff and picked issue with a songwriting credit to derail it.


That was only one disc of potential tracks for the reissue. We don't know if there are other discs planned for it that may include these demos, if the proposed disc was to be included in full or if only select tracks from it were going to be chosen. If Nick didn't appear on "Sympathy for the Demos" why would he have them in his possession to submit for a reissue?
I do find it funny that Richard is apparently "uninvolved" in the compiling of this collection, yet has a live recording ready to go for it's inclusion.


I wonder if this live show will included RA's slagging off Neon Wilderness right before it was played, like he did during a few of the last UH's 98 shows with NM..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 3:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Lil ed wrote:

I wonder if this live show will included RA's slagging off Neon Wilderness right before it was played, like he did during a few of the last UH's 98 shows with NM..





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG76Jb4wSkE

:11 "this is a real fucking downer song..."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:10 am
Posts: 743
Location: Oldham
graceadelica wrote:
Tresilaze wrote:
Sympathy For the demos should be there


And yet wasn't - funny that. The sessions that laid the foundations of the album and the songs that resonate with people are largely (or completely?) absent from that proposed bonus CD. You automatically assume bad faith on Richard's part and good on Nick's - talk about naive. The bonus disc was clearly very deliberately weighed towards Nick related recordings (who was, surprise surprise, involved in compiling it) - suspicious of that, Richard probably called his bluff and picked issue with a songwriting credit to derail it.


Maybe Nick just wants to release stuff that hasn't already been out there for the past 20 years for any fan to hunt down?

Oh Sister and Sonnet were on that disc which were on Sympathy for the demos, the rest is completely unheard which is where the value comes from in these sort of boxes, unheard material.

_________________
THEY CALL HIM CAPTAIN ROCK DID YOU NOT KNOW?!!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 6:54 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 9:46 am
Posts: 1147
Location: California, USA
Maybe I'm missing out on the finer details because I'm not paying attention to FB, but it seems to me that we're attacking Richard without knowing his side of the story. Y'all know I'm willing to **** on him at the drop of a hat, but we haven't even heard from Si or Pete or Chris Potter or anyone else involved with the project to corroborate Nick's version of the story. Just throwing that out there...

Also, with all this talk of sending Nick money, he should start a Patreon. I'd definitely contribute if he'd actually starting putting his stuff up on Bandcamp.

_________________
You'd better pray when the music stops
and you're left alone in your mind
I'll be hearing music 'til the day I die!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:07 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:06 pm
Posts: 288
graceadelica wrote:
Tresilaze wrote:
Sympathy For the demos should be there


And yet wasn't - funny that. The sessions that laid the foundations of the album and the songs that resonate with people are largely (or completely?) absent from that proposed bonus CD. You automatically assume bad faith on Richard's part and good on Nick's - talk about naive. The bonus disc was clearly very deliberately weighed towards Nick related recordings (who was, surprise surprise, involved in compiling it) - suspicious of that, Richard probably called his bluff and picked issue with a songwriting credit to derail it.


You don't know that there isn't another bonus disc of Sympathy for the Demos.

If they aren't there it could be because Richard wants to hide the impact that Nick etc had. He's been minimizing their contributions, and that's why I assume bad faith on his part.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 7:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:14 pm
Posts: 17
He can't put stuff on bandcamp


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:01 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:13 pm
Posts: 948
Location: Spain
[quote="Permanent Starlight"]Maybe I'm missing out on the finer details because I'm not paying attention to FB, but it seems to me that we're attacking Richard without knowing his side of the story. Y'all know I'm willing to **** on him at the drop of a hat, but we haven't even heard from Si or Pete or Chris Potter or anyone else involved with the project to corroborate Nick's version of the story. Just throwing that out there...

Also, with all this talk of sending Nick money, he should start a Patreon. I'd definitely contribute if he'd actually starting putting his stuff up on Bandcamp.


Exactly, I'd like to hear different points of view. Probably the bad ones aren't that bad, and the good ones aren't that good.
_________________
Image Image


This is how they feel when hate it gets so real.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 9:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:33 am
Posts: 1154
Location: Dubai
graceadelica wrote:
Tresilaze wrote:
Sympathy For the demos should be there


And yet wasn't - funny that. The sessions that laid the foundations of the album and the songs that resonate with people are largely (or completely?) absent from that proposed bonus CD. You automatically assume bad faith on Richard's part and good on Nick's - talk about naive. The bonus disc was clearly very deliberately weighed towards Nick related recordings (who was, surprise surprise, involved in compiling it) - suspicious of that, Richard probably called his bluff and picked issue with a songwriting credit to derail it.

Almost all of the tracks on Symphony for the Devils were either on UH (or B-Sides), AWE or HC. And, also, the singles collections (Monte Carlo).

That leaves about 4 songs, two of which were instrumentals. So, Oh Sister and Misty Morning June. Oh Sister was on the proposed CD.

So, it's pretty much all there. What we don't know of are the unreleased tracks after Nick rejoined, whether pre- or post-Urban Hymns. These seemed to be the main tracks proposed (perhaps even Nick played on a later version of Oh Sister)

And, what would you prefer. Unreleased tracks with Nick on. Or Without?

_________________
Quote:
And then he brings back the band for another new song that sounds more Andrew Lloyd Webber than titan of Britpop. It makes Ashcroft's farewell promise to return to our shores "soon" feel more like a threat than something to look forward to


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 10:05 pm 
Offline

Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:10 am
Posts: 8
[/quote]
Almost all of the tracks on Symphony for the Devils were either on UH (or B-Sides), AWE or HC. And, also, the singles collections (Monte Carlo).

That leaves about 4 songs, two of which were instrumentals. So, Oh Sister and Misty Morning June. Oh Sister was on the proposed CD.

So, it's pretty much all there. What we don't know of are the unreleased tracks after Nick rejoined, whether pre- or post-Urban Hymns. These seemed to be the main tracks proposed (perhaps even Nick played on a later version of Oh Sister)

And, what would you prefer. Unreleased tracks with Nick on. Or Without?[/quote]

I agree with all of this and would most certainly prefer to hear the unreleased tracks with Nick on.

Lets presume the Urban Hymns box set contains the following
Disk 1. Urban Hymns
Disk 2. B-sides
Disk 3. Urban Hymns Demos/ Sympathy For The Demos
Disk 4. Unreleased Songs with Nick Mcabe pre and post Urban Hymns
Disk 5. DVD Haigh Hall

Out of all of those, disk 4 is the most interesting to me and if it contained the track listing that Nick posted then it could be the most interesting material to emerge out of all of the reissues.

The fact is that we may not get that now and a live cd might take its place


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 10:22 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2011 11:14 pm
Posts: 17
No way will it have 5 discs


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 11:24 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:10 am
Posts: 743
Location: Oldham
Richard's just signed off on the new album artwork for the reissue


Image

_________________
THEY CALL HIM CAPTAIN ROCK DID YOU NOT KNOW?!!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 5:53 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:23 pm
Posts: 125
Joe Col wrote:
blue vinyl wrote:
Last point, I think I read some discussion of a Forth reissue? That was a joke, right? Forth never should been made. It's utter crap and a stain on their great legacy. I laughed pretty hard though, so if it was a joke, good one.


Nah, no joke. That was me.
I liked Forth. Swap Valium Skies & Rather Be for any of the B-Sides or bonus tracks & it's even more of a belter. As great as the first two albums? No, but there were some brilliant moments on it. Wouldn't need a remaster, but I think an expanded edition with all of the extra tracks & some unreleased material would go down well. Even just to put a final stamp on the band & their catalogue. I do think it will come out. The album went in at number 1; When I broached the subject, Nick didn't say no; The video that was posted here (Ain't The Future A Trip) was allegedly a track from the Forth sessions & referenced Universal Music Group as the label on the video stamp. They handled the first two reissues. The video disappeared within 24 hours; the Urban Hymns set is supposed to be out towards the end of the year, 2018 will mark 10 years since Forth. I can see them bundling the release, like the first two albums. Definitive, conclusive proof? No. But I think there is a good chance of one.
Commence laughter ....


Kinda getting off topic here, but for the sake of a fun argument...really? Are you fucking serious! ;)

Forth went in at number 1 where? The U.K. Charts? So it sold what, 20k units? To quote RPA, COME ON!

The only thing Forth did was put the nail in the coffin. Thank god. Verve ruled. Epic band. But they are done, and Forth proved it. 99.999999% of the public never heard one single song off it. It is so goddamn awful my head hurts. I know Nick likes it and this board is mostly team nick(myself included) but shite is shite.

----end rant-----

Also, on to another post, hard to admit it, but neon wilderness is a terrible song and I'm once again agreeing with RPA. Anyone got Debbie's number?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 1:59 am
Posts: 117
blue vinyl wrote:

Forth went in at number 1 where? The U.K. Charts? So it sold what, 20k units? To quote RPA, COME ON! 99.999999% of the public never heard one single song off it. It is so goddamn awful my head hurts.


73k first week, about 500,000 overall, and LIN was a significant hit on radio. It probably would've gone triple platinum if they'd promoted it. I agree it's a poor album, creatively speaking, and has no business being bracketed with UH.

Re UH: I really hope we get a properly mixed version of 'Don't You Want Me'. Radio 2 would love it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 4:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 9:14 pm
Posts: 1322
Joe Col wrote:
Don't expect "All Ways Are Maybe's" to be on the reissue. A disc of 11 tracks (both unreleased tracks & different takes of album tracks) has been muted in favor of a live disc. The muter? RPA.



ugh. christ. late to the party on this one.

what a PLUM. why cant they have both a live disc AND an outtake disc. ( although clearly take the outtakes if we are only allowed the one extra disc.)

you got one chance to get it right, what a fricking SPOON. and A PLUM he is.

_________________
McCabe's Big Muff


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:09 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2008 12:56 am
Posts: 2080
Lil ed wrote:
Lil ed wrote:
I wonder if this live show will included RA's slagging off Neon Wilderness right before it was played, like he did during a few of the last UH's 98 shows with NM..


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kG76Jb4wSkE

:11 "this is a real fucking downer song..."


I don't interpret that as an insult, whatever the fraying relationships were behind the scenes. He sounds pleased to play it and I think he was more bragging that it's an intense song.

blue vinyl wrote:
neon wilderness is a terrible song


It's not going to make anyone's Top Ten but it's an important track on the album that helps ground it in feeling more like Verve than "Richard and Friends." I believe it was the last thing recorded for the album--seems like that's why it was added.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 2:31 pm
Posts: 2863
blue vinyl wrote:
Joe Col wrote:
blue vinyl wrote:
Last point, I think I read some discussion of a Forth reissue? That was a joke, right? Forth never should been made. It's utter crap and a stain on their great legacy. I laughed pretty hard though, so if it was a joke, good one.


Nah, no joke. That was me.
I liked Forth. Swap Valium Skies & Rather Be for any of the B-Sides or bonus tracks & it's even more of a belter. As great as the first two albums? No, but there were some brilliant moments on it. Wouldn't need a remaster, but I think an expanded edition with all of the extra tracks & some unreleased material would go down well. Even just to put a final stamp on the band & their catalogue. I do think it will come out. The album went in at number 1; When I broached the subject, Nick didn't say no; The video that was posted here (Ain't The Future A Trip) was allegedly a track from the Forth sessions & referenced Universal Music Group as the label on the video stamp. They handled the first two reissues. The video disappeared within 24 hours; the Urban Hymns set is supposed to be out towards the end of the year, 2018 will mark 10 years since Forth. I can see them bundling the release, like the first two albums. Definitive, conclusive proof? No. But I think there is a good chance of one.
Commence laughter ....


Kinda getting off topic here, but for the sake of a fun argument...really? Are you fucking serious! ;)

Forth went in at number 1 where? The U.K. Charts? So it sold what, 20k units? To quote RPA, COME ON!

The only thing Forth did was put the nail in the coffin. Thank god. Verve ruled. Epic band. But they are done, and Forth proved it. 99.999999% of the public never heard one single song off it. It is so goddamn awful my head hurts. I know Nick likes it and this board is mostly team nick(myself included) but shite is shite.

----end rant-----

Also, on to another post, hard to admit it, but neon wilderness is a terrible song and I'm once again agreeing with RPA. Anyone got Debbie's number?


Call me crazy, but I'm beginning to get the impression that you weren't a fan of Forth ...

_________________
"Shout out to Kanye West!"


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 10:56 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:18 am
Posts: 2634
Location: The Divided States of America
It's weird someone hates Forth that much. I mean let's be fair, even if you don't like it, it is still miles beyond RPA's last two solo turds.

_________________
Always Watching (and listening).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2011 3:13 pm
Posts: 948
Location: Spain
Alex wrote:
It's weird someone hates Forth that much. I mean let's be fair, even if you don't like it, it is still miles beyond RPA's last two solo turds.


Image

_________________
Image Image


This is how they feel when hate it gets so real.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:23 pm
Posts: 125
Alex wrote:
It's weird someone hates Forth that much. I mean let's be fair, even if you don't like it, it is still miles beyond RPA's last two solo turds.


Not really, I'll try and explain. Verve went out on top. They won the championship and retired. We were left with great music and a sense of "what if". Then they reunited and hope sprung eternal. Here comes a great record. And then I got Forth and played it.

I most likely cried, I can't recall. A weak imitation of themselves. Not even remotely close to the previous 3 records. Which makes sense, the band was dead and should have stayed buried.

Remember that feeling when you first played Alone With Everybody and punched the wall cause it was such dreck? Well Forth was worse for me because I couldn't blame RPA, even the greatest of all time McCabe couldn't save Verve. He was with the rest of the lads, chilling in the hotel lounge of mediocrity.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 12:31 am 
Offline
seanie boy
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 8:51 am
Posts: 2528
blue vinyl wrote:
Alex wrote:
It's weird someone hates Forth that much. I mean let's be fair, even if you don't like it, it is still miles beyond RPA's last two solo turds.


Not really, I'll try and explain. Verve went out on top. They won the championship and retired. We were left with great music and a sense of "what if". Then they reunited and hope sprung eternal. Here comes a great record. And then I got Forth and played it.

I most likely cried, I can't recall. A weak imitation of themselves. Not even remotely close to the previous 3 records. Which makes sense, the band was dead and should have stayed buried.

Remember that feeling when you first played Alone With Everybody and punched the wall cause it was such dreck? Well Forth was worse for me because I couldn't blame RPA, even the greatest of all time McCabe couldn't save Verve. He was with the rest of the lads, chilling in the hotel lounge of mediocrity.


2 records.

_________________
One third of the Axis of Evil.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 6:26 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 5:23 pm
Posts: 125
Voyager 1, ANS, ASIH

That's 3.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 9:46 am
Posts: 1147
Location: California, USA
@blue vinyl: Fucking de-railed thread, but I'll take the bait. If you don't agree that Blue Pacific Ocean, Ma Ma Soul, Muhammad Ali, Chic Dub, Judas, and Colombo are some of the best music Verve ever made, I don't know what the **** to tell you. Yeah, most of those were b-sides, but they wouldn't have happened without the Forth sessions.

_________________
You'd better pray when the music stops
and you're left alone in your mind
I'll be hearing music 'til the day I die!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 11, 2010 4:10 am
Posts: 743
Location: Oldham
[quote="Permanent Starlight"]@blue vinyl: Fucking de-railed thread, but I'll take the bait. If you don't agree that Blue Pacific Ocean, Ma Ma Soul, Muhammad Ali, Chic Dub, Judas, and Colombo are some of the best music Verve ever made, I don't know what the **** to tell you. Yeah, most of those were b-sides, but they wouldn't have happened without the Forth sessions.


All Night Long and Mover too.

I get the criticism with Forth, as an album it's doesn't cut it. The fact that b-sides and unreleased songs have to be used to justify the album shows how weak it is. That said Blue Pacific Ocean is a top 5 Verve track of all time, that song alone vindicates the entire reunion for me personally.

Out of those album tracks, b-sides, bonus track and unreleased material, a damn good album could have been released, but unfortunately that's not what we got.
_________________
THEY CALL HIM CAPTAIN ROCK DID YOU NOT KNOW?!!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:27 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:36 pm
Posts: 1573
Thaw Session is quality too..


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pointless Urban Hymns Deluxe Box Speculation Thread
PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 2:31 pm
Posts: 2863
That's three more for a Forth expanded edition!!!!!

_________________
"Shout out to Kanye West!"


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 197 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
suspicion-preferred